Universal Access To All Knowledge
Home Donate | Store | Blog | FAQ | Jobs | Volunteer Positions | Contact | Bios | Forums | Projects | Terms, Privacy, & Copyright
Search: Advanced Search
Anonymous User (login or join us)
Upload

Reply to this post | See parent post | Go Back
View Post [edit]

Poster: stbalbach Date: Nov 9, 2013 9:58pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Stealing credit for for Information taken from the Archive

Sheesh sorry to hear. You do all the work for free, even originate the idea, and some kid steals it and overnight gets the credit and money.

What I don't understand, who is paying $10 for manuals that are otherwise free on the Internet Archive. Does he print them?

He might be violating IA's Terms of Service which stipulates no commercial use (or did last I checked).

Stephen

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or Staffgarthus1 Date: Nov 10, 2013 11:20am
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Stealing credit for for Information taken from the Archive

Stephen,

I think that he was exaggerating the money amount, but I also think that someone else was behind it. He actually is in serious legal trouble ... think RICO and Fraud statutes, not just copyright. If I go to court ... and he will have to do several things to satisfy me beforehand ... I guarantee it will cost him much more than he claims that he was making and it will cost me just the filing fees since I can do the papers myself (in fact I was just in Federal court two days ago on an unrelated issue). I found items from other web sites in his inventory and I have already downloaded his entire site so he cannot even lie about it.

I really do not care about the money or even the attribution. What bothers me the most is the corruption that such behavior is causing throughout our economic and social system. These people have no idea about working hard ... ethical or moral values ... creativity or innovation. They are parasites just mimicking the behavior of too many of those around them. It is almost as if we are seeing an orgy of celebrity worship, money worship, and a 'me first' attitude that places feeling good above all else. When this is all over, hopefully he will have learned a lesson about taking responsibility and suffering the consequences of his actions. Something which I constantly talk about in my classes, but which are almost never discussed in the 'Ivory Tower' today.

Gerry





This post was modified by garthus1 on 2013-11-10 19:20:43

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: aibek Date: Nov 10, 2013 7:11am
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Stealing credit for for Information taken from the Archive

Sorry to hear about it. Such behaviour poisons the public space. I hope you bring legal action against the man.

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: stbalbach Date: Nov 10, 2013 6:50pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Stealing credit for for Information taken from the Archive

He should not be breaking the ToS of Internet Archive, the spirit of which has always been free to use.

Unless he is adding value. For example back in 1992, about his age, I did something similar with value-add. When Linux was first being developed, there were only 2 or 3 distributions available and they were very large to download on a 1200 baud modem. So I made advertisements to sell Slackware on floppy disk through postal mail (about 30 disks!) and I actually did "well". Sold them all over the world. I was the first commercial seller of Slackware, maybe the first 5 sellers of Linux period. But that was different since people knew where to get it free, they paid for the convenience of having it mailed on disk.

So it's a hard call because there is nothing wrong with adding value to public domain material. But if he's just selling download rights for $10 of the same file on Internet Archive, that is blatantly wrong and probably Internet Archive should know about it too.

Stephen

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or Staffgarthus1 Date: Nov 10, 2013 9:33pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Stealing credit for for Information taken from the Archive

Stephen,

I think that it is clear that he has violated the Terms-Of-Service for Internet Archive Materials. Taking the information and using it in the way he did is bad enough, but claiming that he did the scanning work and that it is his creation ... that is unforgivable. I will talk to the editor of the newspaper first and try to get his side of the story, but if he refuses to admit to what he did, then I will take the appropriate action. He is in a very difficult spot since the grease fingerprints on my documents, which either I still have or were sent to the Archive; all provide definitive evidence as to where the documents originally came from. And of course the Archive has time-stamped everything which I have downloaded.

Gerry

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: stbalbach Date: Nov 13, 2013 7:32pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Stealing credit for for Information taken from the Archive

Lucky for the greasy finger. That's actually a technique used with secret marks that ID the origin of a digital document. Well I'd be interested to hear how it turns out, good luck with the case.
Stephen

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: Administrator, Curator, or Staffgarthus1 Date: Nov 13, 2013 10:07pm
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Stealing credit for for Information taken from the Archive

Stephen,

I also place my own marks on many documents, but since I routinely obtained damaged or heavily used documents, their condition creates a unique copy. I talked to the student's father today and I will see what happens. He has a chance to clear this up before legal action is taken. In either case he will not get away without suffering any consequences for his actions. It will be up to him now.

Several papers have already given me an opportunity to write a 300-400 word Op-Ed piece. May be a good chance to promote the Archive at the local level. :)

Gerry

Gerry

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: R Pal Date: Nov 14, 2013 1:35am
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Stealing from the Archive

It is interesting that cheating and credit taking seems to be the main thrust of this discussion. The monetizing of free content is also an important issue. It appears the major search engines results do not display free content first. The content on the Internet Archive often falls far down the search list even if the name of the file is used.
I do understand the cheating aspect though. In another persona here on the IA, I have digitized, prepared and uploaded many files. The content is from my own collection of what may be the only existing copy of the works. Few people now have the equipment to use the unconverted media. I do it for fun and for other users who may find it useful.
I now have had tens of thousands of downloads, so there is an interest. Yet an on-line search does not show my Internet Archive file on the first search page. A site that sells my uploaded copies shows up first in the results without any mention of wonderful me or giving the Archive credit and a possible donation.
I now insert a small, unnoticeable 'watermark' in the files that allows me to at least track the usage of the misappropriated files. I now also reload some of the files with more complete version after the initial 'scan and snatch' pillaging period. The material is similar to adding a bonus track found on those laser disc in use today. The file I upload is not renamed, but only a knowledgeable user will notice the added information.
I prefer anonymity, but I dislike the cheating chiselers that seem to profit from others work. Are there any steps that can be taken to allow these free materials to be obtained freely?

Reply to this post
Reply [edit]

Poster: aibek Date: Nov 16, 2013 6:00am
Forum: texts Subject: Re: Stealing from the Archive

Unless you are ready to escalate the issue, there is little you can do. You could write about it on your website (or Slashdot!), and the information would eventually diffuse. But you don’t wish to do that. Forcing the search engines to reform is, obviously, almost impossible, but at any rate, for a start, that too requires concrete evidence (i.e., greater involvement on your part).

Anyway, I present some ideas below, in case you did not consider some of them.

(i) On your IA pages you could mention that some people are copying the songs and selling them. “Forewarned is forearmed”, etc.
(ii) You could spread the songs yourself on sites besides IA (thepiratebay, etc), with the notice that yours are the original ones and are legal.
(iii) Some news sites would be interested in this issue, at least TorrentFreak and TechDirt. In particular, you may request them to study the legal status of the issue. You could even try contacting EFF.
(iv) Assuming that the search engines are biased only against IA, I suppose you will save time and heart-burn by just running a non-IA songs site yourself. Web-hosting is too cheap now!
(v) Sending a DMCA takedown notice, or forcing the pillager to send a DMCA takedown notice to you, would have interesting consequences! It will be a showdown! Perhaps there would be people interested in a pro bono case? (EFF, ACLU?)
(vi) It all depends on what time you are willing to invest in the issue, of course. If the pillager is offering the songs on phone apps you could write to the author of the app (or to Apple or Google). If you engage a lawyer, you could write to the credit card provider/processor regarding the fraud. (IANAL, though.)